DREAMS ARE MY NIGHTMARES

I sleep and dream of
what i never had .
i sleep and scream for
my belongings lost in the Duat.
and the oracle of Delphi,
whispers tales of prophecies .
the past is real, they say
the future will be the same .
and when dawn breaks in,
i wake up perspiring .
not coz of some wet delights,
but from these petrifying visions that fantasize .
i step out with this baggage,
my dreams disguised as nightmares .

Reviews

[JayG]

• I sleep and dream of what i never had .

As a reader who knows nothing about the setting and the speaker, what can this mean? The things I've never had number in the millions, and without knowing at least the subject if the line, isn't the statement without context to a reader? Someone we know nothing about is dreaming of things unknown?

• i sleep and scream for my belongings lost in the Duat.

So if the speaker is dreaming of things never owned, how can they worry about unknown numbers of "things," lost for unknown reasons in the Egyptian underworld?

• and the oracle of Delphi, whispers tales of prophecies .

So I'm lost. The Oracle of Delphi gave prophecies in response to questions. She did not "whisper tales" of them. I suspect that while you have intent for the lines, that intent doesn't make it to the page. Only the words do. So to the reader they mean what the words suggest to THEM.

When we release our words, we, and everything about us, becomes irrelevant. That's why context isn't just important. To a reader it's everything. So when we write, and edit, it must be from within the reader's understanding.

Sorry my news isn't better.

Jay Greenstein
https://jaygreenstein.wordpress.com/category/the-craft-of-writing/

[Mirror]

Dear JayG

"I sleep and dream of
what i never had .
i sleep and scream for
my belongings lost in the Duat."

Have you ever considered that you can not have everything? "What I never had" and "Belongings Lost" Can be two distinctive parameters. The case now is; you seem to have difficulty with which comes first. Remember, you can never have all. Nevertheless, read the opening, "I sleep and dream..." and 'I sleep and scream...." Dreaming and screaming offers the meters that quantifies what had or not. Go back to the voice and listen to the speaker, not the words, its meaning.

You said, "So if the speaker is dreaming of things never owned, how can they worry about unknown numbers of "things," lost for unknown reasons in the Egyptian underworld?" Don't forget it is just a dream. It doesn't determine the real world.

"So I'm lost. The Oracle of Delphi gave prophecies in response to questions. She did not "whisper tales" of them. I suspect that while you have intent for the lines, that intent doesn't make it to the page. Only the words do. So to the reader they mean what the words suggest to THEM. " I think this has to do with the parallel mind. The writer here is projecting a flow of conscious with consciousness. "Whispering.." is the line reminding the reader that is not "THEM" but the thought, "Dream"

Now, if all our ancestral writers wrote to merely make readers understand instead of keeping literal values, depths, and educating minds, then we are grooming lazy minds. Like you said in one of the reviews of your poem "Awake", "that compressing the knowledge of four years learning in school into 300 words post is not easy. And what we know in four years is a trick to write non-fiction."

True writing evolves - abstractly and not restricted to human understanding. A writer flows according to the muse, and real readers appreciate that.

[JayG]

• Have you ever considered that you can not have everything?

You're trying to entertain the reader, so it's your JOB to give them everything they need.

• "What I never had" and "Belongings Lost" Can be two distinctive parameters.

They can be an infinite number of things. And a reader doesn't need you for reason to use their own imagination.

You cannot blame the reader for not understanding. If they don't, it's YOUR fault. Clarity and context are the writer's responsibility.

• The case now is; you seem to have difficulty with which comes first.

As someone who is multiply published, and who has sold poetry, novel form, and short stories, and who owned a manuscript critiquing service, I've talked to agents, successful writers, and other publishing professionals. And if that's taught me nothing else, it's taught me that you cannot, cannot, cannot make a second first impression.

You're not there when the work is read, so the reader cannot ask for clarification. And any intention you have as to word meaning becomes irrelevant because it does not make to to the page.

The reader has only the un-inflected words, which carry none of the emotion you would place into them were you the one reading. Have your computer read the piece aloud and you'll hear that what the reader gets if far different from what you hear as you read. So, in the reader's mind, the meaning isn't what you intend. It's what the reader's background suggests to THEM.

Your reader most likely has a different background.They may be from a different culture, age group, education, and even gender. So your understandings of what a phrase means is driven by both your viewpoint and intent, neither of which are available to the reader.

You either take that into account as you write, and phrase it to have meaning to your reader or you're writing for yourself.

Poetry is a field that has been evolving for thousands of years. Failing to take advantage of that, and learn how to make the reader understand in spite of the difficulties I mentioned would seem to be short sighted, because you cannot argue someone into liking a piece.

As I often do, I suggest you take a look at the excerpt for Stephen Fry's, The Ode Less Traveled, on Amazon. It focuses on structured poetry, but what he has to say about word usage, prosody, and more, is of value to all poets, and prose writers too.

But, since my intent is neither to argue or upset you, I'll just conclude by wishing you good luck with your writing career.

Jay Greenstein

[Mirror]

My dear Jay,

I am not upset with your view. In fact you've been able to argue your point in a civil tone. It is unreasonable to get upset with your points. I understand that we, writers, should consider many factors surrounding our readers as you've professionally stated (With respects to your sound academic background). While that may be admirable, I stand to correct that what we learn at school is a trick reflection of true literature and it core values.

My argument here, is the reader's state of mind (Is it sound or not?). Writing serves as means of construction documentation. Writing as entertainment is secondary. Writing is a presentation of language, culture, and information. Not EVERYBODY is meant to understand. The thought of clarification is left for curious minds, alert minds, studious minds, and ready minds. It is the writer’s JOB to educate first before entertains. Constructive writing tests the mind and patience of readers. Check the I.Q level statistics box and discover how pampered readers have become.

Now, reading culture is declining because publishers, writers, agents, are influenced by what they can sell not teach; hence, creating lazy, dependable, and weak I.Q. How did Shakespearean works become famous in Africa even when Ol' English was difficult to understand? It is a topic for another day.

Origin of Poetry, plays, narrative prose writing evolved into editions and screenplay. In fact one who have read Jane Austin's Pride and prejudice (Sense and sensitivity) will feel the new version of screenplay has done no justice to Jane. How about Ilads? Can our children read the First volume without frowning? How about the feel of Wuthering Heights? What have agents and editor done to Oliver twist, the Animal Farm, and Woman of Substance who wrote to teach moral lessons than satisfy(entertain) the readers.

True writing, in which the content and message is encoded so that another reader can reconstruct, with a fair degree of accuracy, the exact mind written down, is a later development (review). The writer offers blue print, the reader does the work. Poetry is one special writing not meant for all minds and pure entertainment, please consider that.

"As I often do, I suggest you take a look at the excerpt for Stephen Fry's, The Ode Less Traveled, on Amazon. It focuses on structured poetry, but what he has to say about word usage, prosody, and more, is of value to all poets, and prose writers too." Why will I have to depend on Stephen's professionalism to idolize Poetry? I research, yes. I write as a career, No. But I don't condemn those who do? It is worth the while.
Literature and writing, though obviously connected, are not synonymous. The history of literature is the historical development of writings in prose or poetry that attempt to provide enlightenment, instruction, or entertainment, to the reader/listener/observer, as well as the development of the literary techniques used in the communication of these pieces. Not all writings constitute literature. Example, the Holy Christian Bible.

[JayG]

• Writing as entertainment is secondary.

final comment or two before I go:

ALL fiction and poetry serves but one purpose, which is to provoke an emotional response in-the-reader. We don't read a story to learn the details. We read to place ourselves into the story, with the protagonist as our avatar. We don't read poetry to learn how someone we've never met feels. Your mood, your background, and your intent is irrelevant. What matters to the reader is the emotional response the work generates within them.

In Poe's, The Raven, the first stanza sets the protagonist's mood in a way that acts as a measuring stick to calibrate that of the reader. So the READER goes to the door expecting a visitor and wondering who it is, as against just knowing that there is a knock on the door of someone we know nothing about. They have been placed into the VIEWPOINT of the one living the scene. We all see the same scene, but everyone perceives it based on where they sit. So we must invite the reader to take the seat that will cause them to react as we intend. Without that there can be no empathy. And empathy is critical. Assume that someone rushes into the room where you are.Think of the difference between your reaction to two nearly identical sentences:

"Did you hear? A woman was hit by a car a few minutes ago, at the shopping center."

That raises curiosity. But contrast that to, "Did you hear? Your mother was hit by a car a few minutes ago, at the shopping center."

Make it relevant to you, emotionally, and the impact is very different.

This article illustrates the power of placing the reader into the scene, as against just explaining it:
https://jaygreenstein.wordpress.com/2011/09/22/the-grumpy-writing-coach-8/

• Now, reading culture is declining because publishers, writers, agents, are influenced by what they can sell not teach;

Publishing is not, and never has been, a public service. It is a business, and the goal of any business is to stay in business. So it has, and always will, publish only what the public is willing to buy. Any work that does not earn back what it costs to find, prepare, polish and distribute is a drain on the company and is to be avoided.

Your reader is a volunteer, not a conscript. Confuse them or bore them for one single line and they're gone. They arrive with mild curiosity that begins to fade immediately. So unless you begin converting that to active interest, at once, your audition is over. Your first line, of "I sleep and dream of what i never had." would probably be where an acquiring editor would stop reading, for several reasons:

1. Everyone sleeps when they dream, so mentioning it is redundant. And, being awake or daydreaming is secondary to the thought, and slows the narrative. Changing it to, "I dream of what i never had," by reading faster, adds impact.

2. Who cares what someone we know nothing about never had? Added to that, the "never had" of a Iraqi child of 1983 is far different from those of a condemned prisoner in year 2275 in a country that doesn't yet yet exist. Yet you provide no hint of context for the statement. Instead, you write from YOUR frame of reference—one the reader will not share.

It's what the protagonist wants that matters, because there's context inherent to it, and, it's story, not history, making it specific and far more relate-able to the reader who knows only what the words say to any given point. "Never had" could be a dream of a woman, a taste of bacon, or literally anything, so it evokes no emotion, in and of itself. It's the framing that does that.

But forget all that, it's irrelevant to the fact that you are now explaining your intent, and what you believe SHOULD have been my reaction. You're dismissing my comments a the result of my not perceiving your intent. But think about this:

Had I praised the work you would have accepted that without question or analysis. How can you not treat a critical reaction in exactly the same way?

Wouldn't it make sense to try to determine WHY I didn't react as intended and modify the approach so as to hook me, and those like me, while maintaining the interest of those who already praise it? Wouldn't that make you a better poet? Remember, you did ask, and did so (I assume) after reading my other critiques. So my response should not have been a surprise.

Certainly, you can write in any way you care to—if you're writing for yourself. But bear in mind that were you to hope to have an editor accept a given piece, you need to take that editor's viewpoint, and that of the publications paying customers, into account. Because this site is a free venue where anyone can post anything does not remove that necessity. It only allows us to ignore it.

And now, because I've said all I have to say, I will withdraw.

Jay Greenstein

Obv

[Mirror]

Yes, you are very correct. Some readers read fictional works for themselves, as you say, "ALL fiction and poetry serves but one purpose, which is to provoke an emotional response in-the-reader. We don't read a story to learn the details. We read to place ourselves into the story, with the protagonist as our avatar. We don't read poetry to learn how someone we've never met feels. Your mood, your background, and your intent is irrelevant. What matters to the reader is the emotional response the work generates within them." but not ALL. My dear, why then study fictional works at school? Not certainly for ourselves (In sense of studying our emotions)
I, for one, don't read for my emotions, might be sometimes, but very rarely. I read to know what the write has in store of knowledge. That has not made me more knowledgeable, but satisfied to learn others imagination. More seriously, if we write to merely entertain only readers, how can stay true to his/her mind.

"We all see the same scene, but everyone perceives it based on where they sit. So we must invite the reader to take the seat that will cause them to react as we intend. Without that there can be no empathy. And empathy is critical." I can not agree less, excellent point.

"Publishing is not, and never has been, a public service. It is a business, and the goal of any business is to stay in business. So it has, and always will, publish only what the public is willing to buy. Any work that does not earn back what it costs to find, prepare, polish and distribute is a drain on the company and is to be avoided." That's honest, Jay.
"Had I praised the work you would have accepted that without question or analysis. How can you not treat a critical reaction in exactly the same way? " Oh no, Jay. I have actually read your prose work.... leave it at that. Your reaction here for Raghib makes me try to correct a notion you must have portrayed by being one sided - only reader's concern not the writer's muse. Most writers here don't stay in WC because they being paid but for the joy of writing. And you happen to read, post your links to those who are ready to take it up as career while softly protecting those who don't. Look around here, there are no readers, just writers reading other writers. Real readers who don't write are not here.

Now, if I would love to sell my work, Jay you will definitely top my list to be my coach. But right now, I am pointing on academic mind not financial mind. In as much I love money and work in a financial institution, I will never allow it to devalue the real concept of the heart of writing. Separate the themes:
1) Money
2) Minds
3) Values

What is the top priority that maintain the soul of writing? While your points are excellently vivid, garnish with upgrading intelligent quotients through challenges. Remember, the paintings of Mona Lisa. Was it to entertain or maintain, preserve, and immortalize? Thank you for this insightful debate, I have learnt a lot. Cheers, friend.

[Coyote Poetry]

I liked the honest thought shared in the poetry. When dreams become nightmares. What is left. Thank you Raghib for sharing the amazing poetry.
Coyote

[Pragati Chaudhary]

Dreams arent true
For me they arent.....It's just a paradox of how we feel
Nice piece :)

[costa siwale]

I absorbed these words with 'awe'.
intricate perception of nightmares in dreams.
A well written piece indeed

[Raghib]

thank you for your comment costa .

[Najam Us Saher]

Dreams disguised as nightmares, very beautiful phrase. I feel those dreams which we call as our best dreams can turn to worst nightmares. But I didn't think that dreams can be nightmare sometimes. I really liked this poem.

[Raghib]

thank you Najam

[Najam Us Saher]

You're welcome.

[Mirror]

When this title caught my eye, I was mildly shocked. I believed dreams are angelic and when it turns to nightmares, i don't know how to react to it.

"the past is real, they say
the future will be the same ." Got me goose pimples..... great write, Raghib.

[Raghib]

Dreams mostly show what we long for . and when we know we are unable to reach for those things, the same dreams seem as nightmares .

keep visiting .

[Avia]

Dreams are something we can't really control. I think nightmares are fears that linger in our minds and hearts. Hold your hopes close to your heart and chase your fears far away before they engulf those hopes. Nice poem though.

[Raghib]

thats for sure Avia . thanks

[anonymous_at]

It feels terrible.... When your own dreams turn into your nightmares.... And you get caught overthinking... Nice work...

[Raghib]

thank you for the review . keep visiting

[anonymous_at]

ya sure......

[wordman]

dreaming of the one you don1t or can`t have

[Raghib]

well judged wordman . hoped you liked it .

[Dr. YumnaKay]

there's only a thin line separating dreams, nightmares and realities, I think...
Quite a vivid write.

[Raghib]

Thank you for the review
Keep visiting

[Dr. YumnaKay]

You're welcome, I'll try to :)