Vagabond Writers Society Forum Her World

The first topic I want to post for discussion is "Her World". The basic question for thought and discussion is this - What would the world be like if male and female roles were reversed? I have a longer piece on this on my home page in my blog. Go read my blog for a bit more on the topic. The topic is wide open from Mr. Mom to Mrs. CEO to the corporate glass ceiling to dating to war and peace.

I will post some of my own thoughts later, but like I said, I already have on my blog.

Your turn - Ready, set, go......

Okay, so I have a few minutes now to further explain "Her World". Lately, I have done a lot of exploring of the idea of Women being the "breadwinners" and men being the "homemakers". Yes, that was a very sexist way to put it - suggesting that women are homemakers and men are breadwinners in our world today. But that sexism is exactly the point of the exercise and exactly what I want to explore....here are some examples....

Corporate America - anyone with half a brain and who has worked knows darn well that there is a glass ceiling in many corporations. The good old boys network rules and women can only go so high. Sure, times are changing adn there are good places where this glass ceiling is falling. But, by and large, it still exists. If roles were reversed, if women ran the companies, would there be a glass ceiling for men. What would happen - wold guys stand around the water cooler griping that "she" got the job because she "has breasts"? Okay, I find that image funny and ironic itself, but I think the corporate world would be very different in many ways. What say you? How would it be different.

Dating - how would dating be different? in today's it is often the place of men to be the aggressors and women to be the attractors. Men thump their chests and tell old sports hero stories and try to outdo each other to 'impress' women (its quite commical actually) while women will do things like raise their hemlines or lower their shirt lines and wear make up and jewlery. I mean, come on - do women really want to walk around on six inch needles called high heeled shoes? I could be wrong, but most women I have known would gladly turn in the high heels for a decent pair of sneakers. So, reverse the roles - if women are the aggressors, how would they take up the flag. If men are the attractors, do how do they outdo each other? Do they wear jewlery and make up?

What about the right to vote. Women had to fight for that. In Her World, did men?

So, I think you get the idea - its an exploration of stereotypical roles of males and females in society. The idea is to turn it around and upside down and make you think.

Exploring the way the sexes think and act - that is sure to help us create more interesting characters and thus better writers.

And that is what I Vagabond Writers is supposed to be about.

One thing that I just thought about is how the obvious physical dominance of men would translate.

Is spousal abuse a state of mind? a purely psychological thing? Would it now be reversed, with the majority of abuse cases now women vs men? or is it a physical thing?

AND, would it now be that women are the ones expected to do the 'picking up' in bars and such. Gangs of women on the prowl, watching lots of guys dance and 'present themselves'?

*shudders*

After pondering this post for a day or so (I've been awake so long I can't remember what day it is by now) I'm starting to wonder about a few things myself. Would our perceptions of attractiveness be altered? I will use the societal infrastructure of my county to help explain this (well the best I can anyway).

The vast number of guys are attracted to females who have little more than looks to offer. Sex and cars, and the ultimate redneck aphrodisiac (spelling?) football. Okay, I know nascar is the ultimate redneck thing, but talking about it makes me want to vomit. More often than not you hear a guy comment on tits, a*s, legs, or a special ability (you figure it out) that said girl has. It's a possession thing, or at least seems that way. It appears that more often than not males daydream, crush, stalk, whatever the beautiful "prom queen cheerleader" type. Brains, subtle beauty, creativity? I'll get to that

The females- now I'm only speaking on what I've seen and I don't assume this is is every woman or even most women- want the tough guy, the bad a*s, the guy with charm and money. Nerds, geeks, losers, wimps?

When the male is the homemaker and womankind brings in more capital, offers more in the way of monetary investment than he, would men change their viewpoint on attractiveness? I wonder if we would trade the barbie doll porn star for Ms. Corporate America, Ms. President. Its the age old question... mind over matter?

Would women want Mr. Bernie Crocker? Would they find a man who can ice a cake just as sexy as they find Mr. Beefy the underwear model?

These are some of my questions. The thought process isn't finished so I will post more on it later. For now, that's what I leave us with...

D

After pondering this post for a day or so (I've been awake so long I can't remember what day it is by now) I'm starting to wonder about a few things myself. Would our perceptions of attractiveness be altered? I will use the societal infrastructure of my county to help explain this (well the best I can anyway).

The vast number of guys are attracted to females who have little more than looks to offer. Sex and cars, and the ultimate redneck aphrodisiac (spelling?) football. Okay, I know nascar is the ultimate redneck thing, but talking about it makes me want to vomit. More often than not you hear a guy comment on tits, a*s, legs, or a special ability (you figure it out) that said girl has. It's a possession thing, or at least seems that way. It appears that more often than not males daydream, crush, stalk, whatever the beautiful "prom queen cheerleader" type. Brains, subtle beauty, creativity? I'll get to that

The females- now I'm only speaking on what I've seen and I don't assume this is is every woman or even most women- want the tough guy, the bad a*s, the guy with charm and money. Nerds, geeks, losers, wimps?

When the male is the homemaker and womankind brings in more capital, offers more in the way of monetary investment than he, would men change their viewpoint on attractiveness? I wonder if we would trade the barbie doll porn star for Ms. Corporate America, Ms. President. Its the age old question... mind over matter?

Would women want Mr. Bernie Crocker? Would they find a man who can ice a cake just as sexy as they find Mr. Beefy the underwear model?

These are some of my questions. The thought process isn't finished so I will post more on it later. For now, that's what I leave us with...

D

Good thoughts. One thought I see echoed is the dating game. Let us suppose that Women are 'supposed' to do the asking and men the 'attracting'. I ask the group the following questions:

1) As the aggressors, how would women go about it that is different than men? Men do stupid things in this role - they tell inane stories about their football prowess in HS many years ago, they thump their chests (sometimes metaphorically, but they do it), and other dumb things. What would women do differently in their competition with each other to 'impress' some male? How would they approach a man - would it be "So, you come her often?"

2) How would men differentiate themselves? Women wear high heels, makeup, jewelry and specific clothes when they are out hoping to meet someone. What would men do to differentiate themselves to attract the affections of a lady?

And so begins the first exercise - write a pick up scene in Her World. It can be in a bar, in a library, in a park, at the zoo - doesn't matter, you decide. Have a few women and a few men and have the women try to pick up the men. It is up to you to incorporate clothes, speech (e.g., locker room talk is now with women?), pick up lines, actions, physical apperance, etc, etc. Have some fun - make it funny, make it serious, or whatever you want. Don't go for a finished piece, just explore it a bit with your scene. We will explore some of the other questions brought up above and then I will post a contest to write a "Her World" piece (no prices, just bragging "writes").

Oh - and the assumption is that the world somehow evolved this way. that is to say that women have always been the "bread winners" and men have always been the "homemakers". It is the way it has always been.

Have fun with it.

Disclaimer - Yes, I know this is a sexist view and that in the USA (where I am), at least, great progress has been made in gender equality. I can also tell you there is a long way to go. But the USA isnt the only place in the world and gender equivalance is not even close in other parts of the world (at least by US standards). Anyway, stereotyping and flipping the stereotype is the point here. We are exploring how many of us view and express gender roles. Exploring the stereotype is a great way to help us learn what to put in and what to avoid when creating characters.

An interesting topic.

Where I work it is dominated by women with maybe 10% being men. It actually feels completely out of balance. I would love for more men to be involved to round out the environment. In my own experience I think when you have too much of one thing, one view point, everyone can become myopic. The vision, the discussion of programs is narrowed down to what women find important which means we're only appealing to other women. We want to expand our audience but we're not going to reach the male populace if we can't, as a group, appeal to them.

So if I take my own experience which is working in an all female work place and pretend I'm a guy working in an all male environment I can only imagine the narrowed view that would become a state of mind. Introducing a new gender into the mix would be uncomfortable since roles and interactions would be forced to change. Even the way we talk, not just to a different gender but also around different genders. Water cooler conversations would have a whole tennor to it.

Is that necessarily bad? No, but to some people change, any kind of change is damn near a tragedy. It goes beyond uncomfortable and for some it feels hostile or they become hostile.

oh, hell I have a phone call...so much for completing a thought... ::tongue::