The Review Club Forum Discussion of Rob's The Sound ..

This is the place to respond to reviews and for further discussion on Rob's The Sound of a Dying Universe - Chap. 2.

Thanks Gabe for the review. It was appreciated. ;-)

Brilliant review Bill. Thanks for that. That's what I need in this first draft is a close eye for those things, and the pointer than already at 20,000 words I know there are changes going into the first chapters. The general structure of the novel: Part One: On Memory; Part Two: On Forgetting; and Part Three: Truth. Part One is still being developed, although I stepped into Part Two for a bit (not very successfully). Original thought was Part I (first person POV); Part II (second person POV); and Part III (third person POV). You're right that some scenes lack cohesiveness to the themes and story still, and will be either fixed or cut as necessary for flow and purpose when I get to somewhere where you are with yours. I'm already feeling that in the first draft the main thing is getting it down in as cohesive a fashion as possible, but with an open mind as to where the story actually takes you -- unknown until the very end when the 2nd rewrite begins. Cheers! Rob

Thanks Kim for your great review of this piece. Yes, catch those grammar issues because, as you know, sometimes you can't see it. All these things need to be cleaned up anyways, as the story moves forward, so there's no issue getting them cleared up now. Cheers! Rob

I do agree Loekie is right that a teacher likely would not tell the child the way it is in this story, due to Tommy's age. This did cross my mind as I read it, but it is the 60s and some teacher might do this. I think the reaction of the child is the point, and if you do break the news to him another way, it should not require more words for the setup than already used, which might overshadow his reaction; you could simply have his mother have the same talk with him, with one line from her telling how she found out.

One place I might differ from Loekie is on the voice. I wanted more of the narrator, which is the grown man giving his testement, and less of the child's viewpoint. We only need the child's viewpoint to experience what he experiences that is important to the child, but we need the grownup narrator to help us understand why he thinks this was a pivotal point in his life. Course there is a fine line between his explaining it to us and the reader having the chance to figure it out. Only you can show us where you draw that line.

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Thanks Bill and Loekie for that. I thought about doing that at the time I wrote the scene but I thought I'd stick with the school for that to be said, otherwise the school scene becomes superfluous. I would've had to go another 500 words to make the school scene not feel overly superfluous.

I'm struggling with that voice, as I want this to feel memoir but there's a fine line between showing and telling when you skirt that format. I want the commonality to be narrative voice and the feeling it's a memory.

Thanks. Respect. Rob

And what you want to do isn't easy. Here you will get two different camps: more narrator and less narrator. Finding that right balance will be tricky. And not every one will be happy with the end result. The important thing will be that you are happy with what the final product is.

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Hey Loekie, I forgot to say it before. Thanks for the review. I looked over your comments and it's definitely food for thought here. One of the things you mention about certain Canadian references being too narrow, I appreciate the risk I'm taking but I'm trying to avoid being too specific -- to me, a sense of place and time are key ingredients a story has to have, even if it's not necessarily going to be immediately recognizable by the reader. It rings true because it is -- in the sense that these are things I know. I have been trying to give it the flavour of location, without it drowning out the substance of the write.

With respect to voice -- boy -- that's a tough one. I'm already struggling with it at almost 20,000 words because I'm in all new territory now. I feel it becoming more difficult to keep voice, especially as the narrator ages, without it coming across strained. I think that can be fixed in the second go round when I finish the work. Absolutely something I'm going to hold in mind, and as I float through chapter 4 I am working at right now.

With respect to the teacher part. I noted it because I recognized that could be a problem there. I don't know what the best solution is to that, as I want it to happen at the school so the setting in which Tommy knows Anne is the same. You'll notice it later that people are tied to smells, themes, shades of colour and settings throughout the work.

Thanks for the excellent comments. Respect.

Hey cc, thanks for your amazingly thorough review. Respect. I'll gone over your points and I agree. I start to open things up alot more in chapter 3, as I realized what I was doing with the first two chapters. However, with that said, I did purposely structure this as a series of short, almost stand alone stories, ties loosely together at this point -- comfort? I think I can still bind them in the long term, but it's the template I've chosen in order to keep the chapters focused and progressive. Slipping in and out of older/younger voice I'll have to fix and keep it tighter. Since I'm in all new territory I'm not sure how this is going to work out -- but now at about 20,000 words I have a better idea how the frame is going together. Big lesson for me thus far has been secondary characters -- learning to develop them further. I struggling in chapter 4 right now trying to get the right voice and a consistent voice. I'm soooo very much looking forward to getting into chapter 5 where I can get into an adult voice for the rest. The transition in chapter 4 is brutal.

Appreciate and great respect for your comments and assistance. Cheers! Rob

That is all I ask from my reviews. There will be times we'll agree to disagree. I have that right now with CC & Gabe. Often it is just a matter of personal taste and style.

As to the voice issue, boy do I know what you are talking about. A year and a half a ago, I hit a brick wall with my series Tangled Threads. The main issue was voice. I had written 2 1/2 volumes or about 250,000 words plus another 100,000 words of chapters scattered in the subsequent volumes. I've had to go back and make some major revisions, which to this day I am struggling with. Argh! This was meant to be a short story!

Now, the Canadian point. Yup, I see it. I have many of my sci-fi stories set here in Montreal and I've had to walk that fine line. It depends on the audience you are seeking, in the end.

My last point before I take a nap and go to work is about Anne's death. I see your point. I do have a suggestion (when don't I? :-). I can see you need to keep it at the school, be it for the monkey bars or the spider sacs. What if Tommy overhears a couple of teachers talking and learns of Anne's death that way? The tragedy becomes even deeper because the Tommy has no one to talk to. Just an idea.

Cheers.

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One solution I'd thought about when I wrote that portion, before I lazily ended it, was to have a few days pass and wait for her father (the man in the photo) to come by to pick up her stuff from the class. The discussion could come from that instant. I decided at that time to cut to the chase, but I guess no matter what I'll have to go another 500 + words to make it work. Cheers!

Hey Weldon, thanks for the review. I'm appreciating the difficulty with the voice issue, and it seems the camp is rather divided on that issue. I'll have to think about that as slipping in and out of the child's view to the adult's view, I'm erring on the side of the adult voice -- memoir feel. I don't want to lose that strong narrative voice, but yet I also want the reader to fall into the scenes as well. Difficult problem I need to address.

Thanks. More good information to consider. Cheers. Respect. Rob

Thanks Cam for the review. Much appreciated. Cheers! Rob