Alessander's Mad Poets (AMP!) Forum Let's Skip the Usual BullShit!

What DON'T you like in poems?

I have a few culprits:

1) if a poem contains the words "soul" "spirit" "angel" "sin" "evil" "tear" etc.  That's sentimentalism, not beauty.  Also, "thee" "thou" or any other archaic diction.  That's nostalgia, not art.  There are always exceptions...the problem is... everyone always thinks they're it.

2) poems that rhyme but don't have meter.  If it has a organic rhythm, I'm ok with it, but often times, the lines are just long enough to rhyme and nothing else.

3) pink or neon fonts, in some sort of pseudo-gothic calligraphy.  Would your fav poets use those fucken fonts? Thank you.

4) poems accompanied by some soft-porn image.  Usually the fantasy of whom a writer wants to look like or f**k projected unto us unwillingly, or a blatant "sex sells" strategy.  

5) "Spoken Word".  Great to listen to, horrible to read.  So unless I can hear these pieces, next.

I am thinking I should withdraw. I use the words "soul" and "spirit" without thinking in a lot of my work. To me, it is not sentimental bullshit. I am a shaman, which means that I believe in a non-living part of each human being that can travel outside the body, into what we phrase "non-dual reality". We believe there are measurable effects of soul loss due to trauma, such as a root of PTSD and mental illnesses such as depression. There is a psychological component, and a soul component. It is my understanding of these areas that gives me insight into "soul sickness" in individuals and in society. Not in some sentimental way, but in a very real and measurable scientific way. My term of "spirit" refers to the energy and impact an individual has in this world, and the sarkening or lightening thereof. Again, in almost scientific terms, but never-the-less, in words that help other people relate.   I do not want to offend anyone's narrow or devout atheist viewpoint by my use of these terms, but I also do not want to to have to censor my works for inclusion. I am not asking you to believe me; rather, I want to know: should I stay in your groups and risk offending you with my personal beliefs, or leave gracefully?   Respectfully,   Marie

Hmmm, I admit I normally don't read poems over say... twenty lines. If they are I hope they are fast paced to keep my attention. I enjoy short poems ten lines or less and medium length poems ten to fifteen lines. That's just me. Even if a longer poem is written by a world renowned writer I simply have to have the time to read it-- know what I mean.    I have a tendency to agree with your view on archaic language such as "thee" and "thou". It should only be used by someone with say a degree in archaic writing or some kind of professional training and studying in archaic literature. That way it is used correctly. Other wise it should be avoided.  The way a poet can use archaic language effectively would be through the use of allusion-- but only in the line or phrase that they are making a reference to. For instance if a poet alludes to the Bible or Shakespeare in their poem--  the verse or line will probably contain archaic language such as "thee" or "thou". An excellent example of archaic language being used through allusion in a contemporary poem is TS Elliot's "Waste Land".  Anyway, just my thoughts on the effective use of archaic language. Thought provoking topic nice to be a part of it.

Ironic, that someone talks about a "soul" or "spirit" in scientific, Kantian terms, while the very next post is from a Native American that completely ignores that post lol  anyhow, I'm not a materialist, but poetry is not about you being a "guru" or "shaman" or whatever other delusions of grandeur your lacking life compensates for.  That's more than enough for this group:p BTW, I use abstracts, but am not dependent on them :) Just trying to separate the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

I sometimes wish Writers Cafe had these rules for the whole site.

I guess my question is, if I write about the "soul" and have a very specific, non-abstract meaning for what I am referencing, is it still offending your rules? I write for many reasons, and I take my work very seriously. I would prefer not to put effort where it would be wasted or not wanted. Just looking for some guidance, i guess, since I do not want to step on anyone else's boundaries.

I have nothing against IMPLYING about a "soul" or whatever other metaphysical concepts a writer wants to ALLUDE to, I just don't want to read poems with lines like "My soul hurt so much, that the angels wept, and my spirit broke" - sounds nice, but not for this group.  Same with using archaic diction "thou art as lovely as a flame'', again, nice, but not for this specific group.  I use "Adieu" in the "poet" poem, but that's more parody than serious effect.  In other words, anyone in this group can sound like an 19th century poet or metaphysician in their own time-space,  merely not in this little group is all.  That's one of the reasons for the 21 and over age limit (which I was very tempted to make 23 and over), because a lot of younger poets are still under the influence of ancient poets, and tend to imitate and quasi sound like them.  I know I did. 

oh, oh!  Also:

I dislike most of all in poems old fashioned out of use words and self obsession or self importance. Lately I find more annoying than that dishonest reviewers who suck up to people and complement everyone. Also I'm seeing quite often awards in contests going to poems that are full of errors and badly written. Those things more than bad writing is making me lose patience with this site. Has I am serious about my writing and I want to improve. Yet it seems many people are just looking for complements, popularity and points. But that's why I joined your group as that's part of your message. xXx